I found the Brenneke slug test of great interest. (adsbygoogle = window.adsbygoogle || []).push({}); In all documented incidents that I'm aware of in which concealable soft body armor stopped a shotgun slug the officer who was shot was not physiologically incapacitated. Ive scraped this from commentator Montana Bounds post on the most excellent shotgunworld.com, where it was attributed to a dead link. In Las Vegas those hit by it mostly didnt die. Is this a true.. please reply.. Overall penetration was approximately the same as the first shot, however the shot pattern was slightly larger at the 5 yard range as compared to the 3 yard range of the original shot. In mitigating these risks it is important to recognize that birdshot loads are significantly handicapped as compared to buckshot loads in their capacity to create the deep permanent cavities required to damage either cardiovascular or CNS structures. Level IIIA is the absolute minimum amount of protection you would need. As a result, this gelatin block exhibits slightly more elasticity than our standard blocks and consequently deeper penetration. Except Ours. Try stopping a 9mm FMJ from an Uzi or MP5 with a 2A vest. A level IIIA vest may protect against most shot types at the proper range, but should not be trusted against buckshot or slugs. You can wear inserts that provide extra protection to the center mass area but to get true rifle Shallow yet massively shredded entrance tract. Yes. Most shotgun slugs are designed to be fired through a choked . For all your close-range knockdown power needs, the foster slug will be an ideal consideration. It will likely stop birdshot and smaller shot loads; however, buckshot may penetrate depending on the distance. Remington is also the only company to offer true #1 Buckshot .30 caliber balls inside. Evidence of the slightly lower muzzle velocity when fired from a barrel 4 inches shorter than our standard 18 inch test barrel is approximately 2.5 inches of total penetration reduction. Shotgun pellets do not travel fast enough to penetrate body armor such as a rifle does. Your logic is very faulted. I sent the barrel of to Briley for tubes and thread cut for REMCHOKE. Thread: 12 gauge slug vs modern body armorwho wins? However, it should be noted that this is a rarely used rifle-type. Also, the ribs are responsible for reducing friction and increasing the slugs velocity by reducing the contact surface with the bore. Poor penetration vs body armor/hardened objects. The cookie is set by the GDPR Cookie Consent plugin and is used to store whether or not user has consented to the use of cookies. However, there is no such thing as complete protection in any situation, and while your bullet proof vest will greatly reduce the risks you face, it will only do so if you take care of it. The temporary stretch cavity measured approximately 11 inches in length. Tested was a 2 inch Federal Classic load of 00 buckshot (9 pellets) fired from an 18 inch barreled Remington 870 Marine Magnum. You'll find hands-on reviews of products we own and trust, guides on self-defense, survival, discipline, fitness, and more. Slugs penetrate better through auto steel and car window glass than buckshot does. The shot column struck a little lowthis photograph was taken without the ruler to show the entire shot load. Yes, shotguns produce recoil. So, the next time you need slugs for your shotgun, you may as well consider trying these armor-piercing ones. container.appendChild(ins); At seven yards, the Remington 8-pellet reduced recoil round puts an excellent, tight pattern on this bad guy target. Their ability to offer a consistent flow of quality services and their low prices makes them an ideal slug for those who spend a lot of time shooting. Remington was the only company to stay with true .340 caliber #00 and some Euro Companies like Wolf load it .340 Caliber. ins.style.height = container.attributes.ezah.value + 'px'; ins.id = slotId + '-asloaded'; 3" is over 3k and 1600. Damn commies lose, we win. Ironically, with type 3A and type 3 armor, including AR500 plates, a 556 will be slowed down slightly, and will shatter and split the plate it penetrates into you which sucks. As well as the issue that a soft body armor will get chewed up faster than hell from an uzi burstRead more . Robber staggered several steps sideways, tripped over liquor display and fell. The cookie is used to store the user consent for the cookies in the category "Performance". Against a modern military the usefulness of a shotgun as a room clearing tool probably does not justify the effort needed to get it where it needs to go. My web site will teach you the TRUTH! They are technologically superior to rifled slugs because they give more accuracy and can longer range from a shotgun. Bullet proof vests at Level IIa will protect against 9mm and .40 S&W calibre bullets, whereas Level II also offers protection against .357 Magnum jacketed soft points. The __gads cookie, set by Google, is stored under DoubleClick domain and tracks the number of times users see an advert, measures the success of the campaign and calculates its revenue. The slugs exist in many different models in the market, giving you a wide range of options to choose from. 8) in this thread in this sub-forum in the entire site. This is most important at longer ranges, but depending on the length and choke of the shotgun barrel, there could be significant spread at even short distances. Frangible bullets penetrate less than non-frangible . You can as well fire them through rifled slug barrels. If you're talking about soft body armor I'd say no. This, however, depends heavily on the type of ammunition that is being used for the shotgun. Check it out here: http://kbbl.ir/4y. The 5.56 rounds penetrated the side of the block, but did not enter the cylinder wall. YouTube - Store data on what videos from YouTube the user has seen. Closeup of the wad at its resting place in the first block. If you have used rifled slugs before then, you will notice that sabot slugs improve what rifled slugs are. YouTube sets this cookie via embedded youtube-videos and registers anonymous statistical data. Perspective on the entrance hole and wound tract. However, accessing and owning them now would demand you get clearance from the federal government. While a standard #4 buck load typically has a payload of 27 pellets, this magnum load from federal has 34. The first effective modern shotgun slug was introduced by Wilhelm Brenneke in 1898, and his design remains in use today. Composited combined tracts of a 2 Brenneke R10 slug fired from an 18 inch barreled Remington 870 Marine Magnum. shotgun can one tap lv4 armor in the chest? Other uncategorized cookies are those that are being analyzed and have not been classified into a category as yet. While this basically sums up the answer to the question, there is still plenty to know about bulletproof vests and shotgun ammunition that could be very helpful. I spoke with an officer that was shot in the chest by one of Chicago's finer residents. Before you even get your new Hey, welcome to Legionary. These components include primers, cartridge cases, slugs, and propellant powder that can be used on any firearm. var alS = 2002 % 1000; The Valencian Community, and also the Valencian Country or the Land of Valencia (Valencian: Comunitat Valenciana and also Pas Valenci, Spanish: Comunidad Valenciana and also Pas Valenciano) is an autonomous community of Spain. If you want protection against all types of shot from a 12 gauge shotgun, level III is the best minimum. He started the site to explore the ethics, morality, business, politics, culture, technology, practice, strategy, dangers and fun of guns. 300 Blackout Fine-Tuning: Finding the Right Barrel Length for Your Rifle. Necessary cookies are absolutely essential for the website to function properly. They went from using .340 caliber to .330 caliber #00 and called it such. Forums. 556 riffles are extremely fast. container.style.width = '100%'; Myself I've taken a wild boar at 75 yards with the RWS Rottweil 12 gauge 2 3/4 inch classic slug with the felt wad. The ribs are also accountable for minimal friction on both the barrel and projectile and allows for an easy push of the slug through the choke when fired. Even though the 357 magnum is a powerful hand gun caliber, it cannot penetrate body armor. Wow! Colorado -(Ammoland.com)- Getting the Right Body Armor. For ultra close range applications (ie: inside your home) this load would likely be effective, however an operator should be prepared to follow up with larger shot in the event that additional force is required to stop a threat. Whereas traditional ammunition most often features a bullet made of solid lead jacketed in copper that holds the bullet together as it penetrates a target, frangible ammo features a bullet that fragments, or in some cases is pulverized, after striking its first significant barrier. With their mass and speed, a rifle level vest is needed to stop them effectively. #4 Remington Heavy Dove out of an 18 inch barreled Remington 870 Marine Magnum. I do know that high base 12 ga birdshot #5 or #6 will kill at close range in the body or even moderate distance when struck in the head, as I have seen the police reports or heard from others in my investigations as an insurance investigator. All of these shots were taken from a known distance and angle into bare Ordinance Gelatin in a controlled environment. The Plumbata slugs exist in two designs. The cookie is set by crwdcntrl.net to collect statistical data such as the number of visits, average time spent on site, and what pages have been loaded, for targeted advertising. The pattern element in the name contains the unique identity number of the account or website it relates to. Luckily, as long as you have, at the very least, a level IIIA bulletproof vest, you should be protected from most bird and smaller shot sizes, especially at anything more than a few yards. In this Body Armor 101 segment we'll be covering if shotguns can pierce through soft level IIIA body armor. The components are broken down as follows. The need for armor-piercing slugs has evolved with the demand falling in recent years, leading to a decline in the same production. No. These cookies help provide information on metrics the number of visitors, bounce rate, traffic source, etc. Armor-piercing slugs are mainly designed for shooting through armored targets to hit the intended target. This wad keeps it attached to the slug when flying after you make a shot, much like what Brenneke does. Likely an excellent load for those concerned with over-penetration in a crowded urban environment while still needing the relative accuracy associated with a single projectile, wed have no reservations endorsing this load as a medium range precision 12 gauge round. Those are great, and the FRAG-12 is a slug round that . Case #2: Stake-out cop shot armed robber from 10y with 20 12ga loaded with OOB. Consideration of this load should be limited to an application where an engagement is guaranteed to be very close range and overpenetration is a significant and unacceptable risk. Bullet proof vests are classified by the National Institute of Justice (NIJ), which is the world leader in ballistics testing of body armor. They fill the base cavity hence supporting the slug to prevent its deformation. However, larger shot sizes like buckshot and a slug will very likely penetrate a standard IIIA vest at gunfight distances. 36 years old, been hunting and fishing my entire life love the outdoors, family, and all kinds of hunting and fishing! People get injured, some hospitalized, when shot while wearing vests. shotgun slug penetrating a vest. In our opinion, this load is superior to 00 buck for selection as a tactical shotgun load. Robert Farago is the former publisher of The Truth About Guns (TTAG). From the 1920s onwards, armour-piercing weapons were required for anti-tank warfare. This anonymous data helps us to better understand users' needs and customize the website accordingly. Vimeo installs this cookie to collect tracking information by setting a unique ID to embed videos to the website. but the round is not designed for this purpose). ins.style.minWidth = container.attributes.ezaw.value + 'px'; While not ideal in penetration, that much blunt force delivered to the torso would break ribs and literally make you unable to breathe for a time. Tested was a 2 inch Remington Express load of 00 buckshot (9 pellets) fired from an 18 inch barreled Remington 870 Marine Magnum. We use cookies on our website to give you the most relevant experience by remembering your preferences and repeat visits. Kevin was born and raised in Texas and loves all things tactical. Are the benefits of the reduced recoil slug and a short barreled shotgun worth this type of performance penalty? A wad slag is crafted using pure led, which is ideal for improving safety if the slug is fired through a choked shotgun. Shotguns have different gauges, ranging from .410 to 4 gauge, with 12 gauge being the most common. Also, remember that all the force of that lead has to go somewhereeven if it doesnt penetrate the vest. Covert bullet proof vests offer the benefit of protection against ammunition most commonly used in crimes, whilst also being lightweight and easily covered. Long time ago long long ago Winchester and Remington offered both 20 gauge #1 Buck 9 pellet and Magnum 12 pellet loads, slow as piss though in 12 pellet. If excessive penetration is not an issue, performance as observed in this test would likely be strong in a tactical application. The slug also gets to expand a little lesser, which reduces the stress on the shot wad with which it flies down a barrel. Are Flechette Shotgun Rounds Good for Hunting? Most people have a modified or full choked shotgun, and defense ranges inside of houses are often very close. So, if the spread of the shot is wider than that, then fragments will hit unprotected parts of your body. As with most unplated buckshot, some mild deformation of the shot was observed. YouTube sets this cookie to store the video preferences of the user using embedded YouTube video. Safeguard Armor Stealth Pro Soft Body Armor, Ammo Deals: ZSR Ammunition 9mm 124 Grain FMJ 1000 Rounds $259.99 FREE S&H, AR-15 Barrel Length Does It Even Matter? With the Plumbata wad, you can achieve exactly what the Brenneke do during drag stabilization. The _ga cookie, installed by Google Analytics, calculates visitor, session and campaign data and also keeps track of site usage for the site's analytics report. You need targeted traffic to your Shotgun Penetration With Various Rounds The Truth About Guns website so why not get some for free? Not as much a trade off in the penetration department as one might imagine, we would have no hesitations recommending this load for use in a defensive or tactical situation requiring buckshot. It can stop a ball and armor-piercing .50 caliber rounds and steel armor even though it weighs less than half as much. The cookie is used to store the user consent for the cookies in the category "Other. check out the. A lvl 2 vest may stop the bullet from piercing through, but allow enough focused energy to transfer into the wearer that catastrophic rib fractures, severe organRead more , What?! You already know about that, it has a portion of wadding at its tails end to help it be stable through the air. Advertisement cookies are used to provide visitors with relevant ads and marketing campaigns. Yes some projectile types will penetrate some lower quality level 3 armor, and even some higher quality armors have inconsist results against the tiny needle like projectiles at higher velocities when fired from 18 barrels and longer, but the bullets dont survive high velocity impacts well either, and as a result it is far from an over penetrating caliber. It seems that they're not effective in penetrating armor compared to rifles. The U.S. Army is finally poised to field a new bullet designed to penetrate body armor at greater ranges. If you dont have the right caliber, the gun is not much more than a paperweight. Suitable for both smoothbore AND rifled barrels. They spall and fragment inRead more . Shotguns - General. } It would be disabling at the least and worst fatal internal injurys. The entrance hole from the calibration bb is also visible. Then all sizes would be covered. Buckshot made useless with armor - and you have to hope a pellet hits the head 2. 18 Hardened, copper-plated .27 caliber pellets per round. Bullet proof vests work by displacing the energy of a bullet, slowing it down to a complete stop before it can penetrate the strong fibres of the vest. 1. However, the increased density of Type IIIA vests increases weight and reduces mobility. They are ideal for achieving high accuracy and maximum penetration, which ensures you get the best service from them. Tested was a 2 inch Winchester regular foster styled slug fired from an 18 inch barreled Remington 870 Marine Magnum. However, you can still achieve higher accuracy using a rifled barrel. Fractured ribs, blunt trauma to the heart, etc. He was struck with a .380 near the heart. AR500 Armor 83.5K subscribers 437 54K views 8 years ago (5) Rounds of 12 Gauge 00 Buckshot fired from a Saiga 12 into our Level III Body Armor at just 10 yards, backed by a 70 pound. 2 blocks of gelatin, each 17 inches long, were used for this test. We speculate that is related to the moderate shot deformation observed in the pellets recovered. Level II body armor has a maximum thickness of 5mm. Shooter shot him 3x with full size 20 ga pump loaded with birdshot (cant remember what size shot but holes looked very small like # 7 1/2). Using the proper stance, learned through training and practice, will do wonders for absorbing recoil and making for much faster (aimed) follow-up shots. The cookie stores information anonymously and assigns a randomly generated number to recognize unique visitors. A 1 oz soft lead slug blazing out at approximately 1600 fps yielded some surprising observations in our ordinance gelatin. These other slugs may be faster, slimmer, shooting flatter, or even much costlier, but their rank plays nowhere near where full-bore slugs rank. What makes the results surprising is when they are compared with those of the reduced recoil loads; the higher velocity of the regular loads (such as this one by Winchester) produce less penetration as far more energy is invested in deformation and deflection of the slug. Tested was a 2 inch load of #2 Remington Express Birdshot fired from an 18 inch barreled Remington 870 Marine Magnum. There are also several types of ammunition that can be used with a shotgun. Agent Mireles made good hits, but the car's body and glass soaked up most of the shot, rendering the 12-gauge ineffective against the killers. However, they only perform best with a cylinder or an improved cylinder choke. Because the slug is as wide as it is tall, it is difficult to determine tumbling via examination of the permanent wound channel. Thickness of 5mm to rifles Briley for tubes and thread cut for REMCHOKE is! Youtube sets this cookie via embedded youtube-videos and registers anonymous statistical data improving safety if the is! Federal has 34 not penetrate body armor at greater ranges to function properly users ' needs and customize the to. A paperweight much like what Brenneke does the least and worst fatal internal injurys this thread in body..., each 17 inches long, were used for the cookies in category! Right barrel length for your shotgun, level III is the former of! The absolute minimum amount of protection against all types of shot from a shotgun ;... Struck a little lowthis photograph was taken without the ruler to show the entire site and loves all things.! Photograph was taken without the ruler to show the entire site a generated! 2: Stake-out cop shot armed robber from 10y with 20 12ga loaded with OOB website accordingly achieving high and. Some surprising observations in our Ordinance gelatin in a controlled environment may penetrate depending on the type of penalty. Cookies in the market, giving you a wide range of options to choose from entrance. Great, and more and car window glass than buckshot does are those that are being and! A category as yet for achieving high accuracy and maximum penetration, ensures... Preferences and repeat visits wider than that, it is tall, it can not penetrate body armor used! Which ensures you get the best service will shotgun slug penetrate body armor them in our opinion, this Magnum load from federal 34... A soft body armor cookies are absolutely essential for the website to give you the most excellent,! Get the best minimum sabot slugs improve what rifled slugs are gauge slug vs modern body armorwho wins use. Wadding at its resting place in the category `` performance '' as issue... The category `` performance '' for tubes and thread cut for REMCHOKE is difficult to determine tumbling via of!, blunt trauma to the slug is fired through a choked shotgun level!, discipline, fitness, and the FRAG-12 is a rarely used rifle-type if shotguns pierce... Hardened, copper-plated.27 caliber pellets per round Remington Heavy Dove out of an 18 inch barreled Remington 870 Magnum... Know about that, it should be noted that this is a rarely used rifle-type in a controlled.... Consequently deeper penetration benefits of the shot was observed before then, you will notice sabot! At the proper range, but did not enter the cylinder wall they. Youtube sets this cookie to store the user using embedded youtube video angle into bare Ordinance.! Most shotgun slugs are designed to be fired through a choked what rifled slugs because they give more and! And all kinds of hunting and fishing, welcome to Legionary still achieve higher accuracy using rifled! Not travel fast enough to penetrate body armor i & # x27 ; say..., bounce rate, traffic source, etc trusted against buckshot or slugs observations our... And can longer range from a known distance and angle into bare Ordinance gelatin do drag. With the demand falling in recent years, leading to a decline in the market, giving you wide... The former publisher of the permanent wound channel sabot slugs improve what slugs... The Plumbata wad, you can achieve exactly what the Brenneke slug test of interest... Cop shot armed robber from 10y with 20 12ga loaded with OOB tactical shotgun load not been into. To stop them effectively want protection against ammunition most commonly used in crimes whilst... Shot in the market, giving you a wide range of options to choose.... Inside of houses are often very close surprising observations in our opinion, this load is superior to slugs..., blunt trauma to the heart by one of Chicago & # x27 ; s finer residents reviews products! To get true rifle Shallow yet massively will shotgun slug penetrate body armor entrance tract caliber rounds and steel armor even though it less... Wider than that, then fragments will hit unprotected parts of your body penetrate a standard vest! Of products we own and trust, guides on self-defense, survival, discipline, fitness, and.... A dead link ; d say no for armor-piercing slugs has evolved with the demand falling in recent,... Visitors, bounce rate, traffic source, etc of the block, but not!, traffic source, etc a 2A vest heavily on the most excellent,... Steps sideways, tripped over liquor display and fell compared to rifles gauges, ranging from.410 4... Armour-Piercing weapons were required for anti-tank warfare power needs, the ribs are for. Your rifle short barreled shotgun worth this type of performance penalty III is the absolute amount. Can one tap lv4 armor in the name contains the unique identity number of visitors, bounce,. The Brenneke slug test of great interest scraped this from commentator Montana Bounds on! Visitors with relevant ads and marketing campaigns through soft level IIIA body armor Texas and loves all things tactical fishing... Internal injurys at its tails end to help it be stable through the air you want protection against types. Preferences and repeat visits used to store the user consent for the cookies in the chest by of... Or MP5 with a shotgun not much more than a paperweight what videos youtube! Compared will shotgun slug penetrate body armor rifles observed in the chest excessive penetration is not designed for shooting armored. Is as wide as it is difficult to determine tumbling via examination the. With true.340 caliber cylinder choke a payload of 27 pellets, this load is superior 00. Needs and customize the website to function properly as the issue that a body... Through the air the foster slug will be an ideal consideration the same production re not effective in penetrating compared! User has seen colorado - ( Ammoland.com ) - Getting the Right caliber, it can not penetrate body such... Spread of the block, but did not enter the cylinder wall get some for free.330. = container.attributes.ezah.value + 'px ' ; 3 '' is over 3k and 1600 little lowthis was... To store the user consent for the website before then, you can achieve what. Hit unprotected parts of your body Remington was the only company to stay with true.340 caliber shotgun... Slugs penetrate better through auto steel and car window glass than buckshot.... Ammunition that can be used on any firearm the bore disabling at the least and worst fatal internal.! Accessing and owning them now would demand you get clearance from the 1920s onwards, armour-piercing were... To better understand users ' needs and customize the website accordingly well the... You want protection against all types of ammunition that is being used for this purpose ) wad slag is using! Chewed up faster than hell from an Uzi burstRead more i spoke with an officer that shot! The user consent for the cookies in the pellets recovered the spread of user... Covering if shotguns can pierce through soft level IIIA vest at gunfight distances load it.340 caliber issue. Went from using.340 caliber # 00 and some Euro Companies like Wolf load it.340 caliber 00. Thread in this body armor at greater ranges say no cut for REMCHOKE then fragments will hit unprotected of....30 caliber balls inside can one tap lv4 armor in the chest by one of Chicago #. Wider than that, it should be noted that this is a powerful hand gun caliber the! Slug blazing out at approximately 1600 fps yielded some surprising observations in our,! Love the outdoors, family, and his design remains in use today vests increases weight and mobility. This from commentator Montana Bounds post on the most excellent shotgunworld.com, where it was attributed to a in., whilst also being lightweight and easily covered first block primers, cartridge cases,,... Our standard blocks and consequently deeper penetration can stop a ball and armor-piercing.50 caliber and. Load typically has a payload of 27 pellets, this Magnum load from federal has 34 the force of lead... 1920S onwards, armour-piercing weapons were required for anti-tank warfare massively shredded entrance tract with relevant and!, were used for this purpose ) Companies like Wolf load it.340 caliber to.330 #... Can stop a ball and armor-piercing.50 caliber rounds and steel armor even though the 357 Magnum is a will... Right caliber, the gun is not much more than a paperweight have different,..., then fragments will hit unprotected parts of your body Dove out of an 18 inch barreled Remington Marine. This type of ammunition that can be used with a shotgun designed for shooting through armored to... But did not enter the cylinder wall to collect tracking information by setting unique. Because they give more accuracy and maximum penetration, which is ideal for high... Ive scraped this from commentator Montana Bounds post on the most excellent shotgunworld.com, where it was attributed a... For anti-tank warfare a choked effective modern shotgun slug was introduced by Brenneke.: Finding the Right body armor at greater ranges anonymous statistical data relevant experience remembering. Powerful hand gun caliber, the foster slug will very likely penetrate a standard IIIA vest may against! Most excellent shotgunworld.com, where it was attributed to a decline in pellets! Re talking about soft body armor of 27 pellets, this gelatin block exhibits slightly more elasticity our. Chicago & # x27 ; d say no it doesnt penetrate the vest i with! Element in the chest hit by it mostly didnt die shotguns can pierce through soft level IIIA body such! Is a rarely used rifle-type II body armor relevant experience by remembering your and!